Pegasus 70W versus Mini Pegasus - Temp Control

I currently have the Pegasus Mini from the Odyssey mini kit. I've moved to the Triton 2 tank rather than the Triton mini just for better airflow. I'm a dedicated temp control vaper, so those are the only coils I'm using. I vape 3mg nicotine juices between 60/40 and 80/20 as my regular juices.

My question is this: Will the full sized Pegasus 70W bring the coil up to temp faster than the Pegasus Mini? Is the Pegasus 70W a better fit for the Triton 2 tank? I know that they both have the same temp range (200F - 600F). I'm using the NI200 Triton coils consistently and I tend to run my temps between 300 and 450 depending on the juice and my mood. I have noticed that the first draw almost always causes a weak cloud, where the next draw done quickly after is a much thicker and opaque cloud, specially on 80/20 juices.

Would I actually see a benefit moving from the Pegasus Mini to the full sized Pegasus using this Triton 2 tank and NI200 temp control coils? What would that benefit actually be? Would there be any downsides?
Comments
  • 21 Comments sorted by Votes Date Added
  • Old_Salt said:

    @GPF

    My question for you is what period of time do you want the joules for?

    FYI, the Pegasus is rated at 70w, while the Pegasus mini is rated at 50w. You will of course need to ensure your battery is capable of delivering that power.

    What I want to know is the answer to a simple question.

    Question Setup: I have a full sized Triton 2 tank with a temp control NI200 atomizer on a Pegasus Mini mod. I changed from the Triton Mini to the Triton 2 due to better airflow through the full size Triton tank. I have noticed that, specially at higher temps (475-600), it takes a very long time for the coil to achieve the temp I set. Sometimes, the coil never makes it to the temp I set by the time I finish inhaling, or only spends half a second or so at the temp right at the end of my inhalation. I verified this by watching the display in a mirror. I have noticed that my first draw always is a weak cloud with minimal taste if I've let the mod, tank, and coil get to room temperature. When I draw for a second time right after the first, I then get a thick cloud with good taste and smell since the coil hasn't had time to cool off completely.

    The simple question is this: Will I actually benefit from moving to the 70W Pegasus in terms of the coil achieving the temperature I set faster?
    charlzrocks
  • Uhhhh....what? No, really what I have found to be true is the same thing you experienced (first puff weak, second one better) when I am using a battery in my mod that can't handle the wattage as well. I am using the .5 ohm coils in wattage mode so YMMV. The best course of action would be to try a more powerful battery first before going to another mod that might not do the trick with a substandard battery. The Pegasus model mods have a throttling circuit built in so that if the battery can't handle what you are asking of it, it throttles down to a lower power that it can handle. I suggest trying the Aspire 20-40A Super High Discharge battery or another like it before investing in another mod.
    GPF
  • @GPF

    I've spent over twenty years as an electronics technologist. Joules is a meaningless measurement in vaping used as a marketing ploy by some manufacturers to sell their MODs. The power used in TC vaping varies during coil warm-up, and while puffing. The instantaneous power measurement is of some use. The maximum voltage and power a MOD can put out are actually the most important specifications of a MOD for TC. They determine how quickly a coil can be brought up to vaping temperatures. If you've seen YouTube videos put out by those building coils for their RDAs, you'll have seen that coils take a few seconds to come up to temperature, even with multi-battery MODs. It's not instantaneous. The more power your MOD is capable of delivering to your coil, the shorter this warm-up time will be. The Pegasus putting out 70W will bring the coil up to vaping temperature faster than the 50W Pegasus mini.

    The Sony VTC 5 is acknowledged as the king of high drain batteries. Aspire's 40A 1800mAh battery is also very good. You'll find that the higher the drain the battery is capable of sustaining, the lower its storage capacity. The high drain batteries also have a lower internal resistance than the low drain batteries. That's important to vapers, especially those using single battery MODs as more of the battery's power can be delivered to the coil.

    When using TC while vaping, fire the coil, and give it time to come up to temperature before puffing. You'll get better results, and that first puff will be as satisfying as the second, or third.



  • Very good question. @Tina can you answer how many Joules the Pegasus runs in TC mode vs the Pegasus mini?
  • watkijw said:

    Very good question. @Tina can you answer how many Joules the Pegasus runs in TC mode vs the Pegasus mini?

    I hate to come across like a jerk, but it's been over 24 hours since I asked my question here in the manufacturer's forum. Is this what I can expect from Aspire, or is there a faster channel to talk with them outside this forum?
  • Well since it's the weekend and China is 14 hours ahead of us, their weekend is... as of this writing almost noon on Sunday. Give it some time. They will give an answer...right @Tina?
  • edited January 2016 Vote Up0Vote Down
    @GPF

    joules = watts X seconds. It's a measurement similar to Kwh just on a smaller scale.

    Watts are the instantaneous measurement of power delivered by the MOD, while joules are the total power delivered over a period of time. As an example 50w for one millisecond is a power consumption of 0.05 joules, while 50w for ten seconds is 500 joules. Note that the power is the same, only the time has changed.

    My question for you is what period of time do you want the joules for? A per puff measurement is useless, as the time per puff varies. A per battery charge would depend on your battery type, and where it is in its life cycle. For TC, you start with a high power level that tapers off as your coil reaches the temperature set point. It will then level out, so the joules during the first second of your puff will be much higher than that of the last.

    FYI, the Pegasus is rated at 70w, while the Pegasus mini is rated at 50w. You will of course need to ensure your battery is capable of delivering that power.
  • @charlzrocks

    Well since it's the weekend and China is 14 hours ahead of us, their weekend is... as of this writing almost noon on Sunday. Give it some time. They will give an answer...right @Tina?

    I knew there was going to be a response to my post exactly like this! Thanks, charlzrocks, for filling my heart with actual joy and mirth. Really. No sarcasm or any bad feelings hidden away. I needed to feel better this morning, and your post actually and truly did help. It proved me right, so that' s why I'm happy.

    But, to the meat of the deal...Aspire (along with Kangertech and many others) are Chinese companies selling worldwide. Both of the ones I mentioned have a US based website and wholesale group. As an example, it took me 2 minutes on google to find the US side for Kanger (www.kangertechus.com) and the Chinese side (www.kanger-tech.com). The support numbers are different. US Side: 1-888-799-1988, Chinese side: *86-0755-27240906. Another 2 minutes and I have the same from Aspire. US -based website (aspireusa.com), Chinese website (aspirecig.com). Aspire doesn't care for giving out it's phone, but it does have specific email addresses for specific concerns. Aspire has other companies doing their support. UVAPER, LLC in the US and Pacific Smoke International, Inc in Canada, and this very forum we're typing on is hosted through their Chinese site.

    All of that to say this: Aspire is, whether they like it or not, a worldwide company. They have deep penetration into the two richest countries in the world, the US and Canada. They should have a 24-7 visibility on this website, specifically the customer section, since that's how they make money and continue to operate. A customer is not just someone that bought something from you at one time, they're a potential source of income for years to come. If they consider this website something to deal with during normal business hours, they're making a terrible mistake. Being a worldwide company means that 'business hours' are 24 per day, and 7 days per week.

    At this point, you're probably angry with me and what I'm typing. You may think I'm being unreasonable. You may even think that I don't care about @Tina and want her to work every day all day. That is not what I'm saying or thinking. I want Tina to have more Life than Work. I want her to have her time off to be free of worries from work, since life gives us enough worries as it is.

    This isn't about Tina. This is about Aspire, a World-Wide seller of vaping equipment. Aspire, a company that I have purchased equipment from, and Aspire, the company to whom I asked a question regarding moving up to a more expensive version of one of their products, meaning more money and a more loyal customer. As a single person, my money may not mean very much by itself, just like in the US with "One Person - One vote". But, one person tells others, others tell others. One person, offered a product from a certain manufacturer at a vape shop, loudly refuses to even look at it, much less try it out, will make an impression on that vape shop owner and their decisions on what to keep in stock. At that point, one becomes a few which becomes many. And 'many' will affect your income and standing.

    Guys, this is getting long and I apologize to you, but it's not FOR any of YOU at this point. It's to Aspire, the company, and it's my viewpoint as someone who has grown up in the USA, surrounded at all times by marketing, advertisements, and attempts to grab my attention and money. I'm a 'professional customer', and anyone born and raised in a capitalistic environment is exactly that, even if they're not aware of it. I'll be 50 in March 2016, and, luckily, with some training and deep introspection, I've been able to see how this works. I'm trying in my own way to help you guys, at least in regards to this forum and your company.

    If this forum is just a volunteer operated thing, barely connected to the company, and only operates during the hours that the Mods are available and decide to log in, then hand it off to the volunteers and make that obvious on every single page. If, however, this is part of the Marketing arm of your company (which company forums are...customer service is a secondary benefit), then treat it with the attention it deserves.

    Aspire, would you let an advertisement out into a magazine without it being inspected by multiple people and finally given the OK to print by some person the company trusts deeply to market their products? Your websites are beautifully created with wonderful photography, brilliant technical movement in the video backgrounds, and, in the end, totally controlled by Marketing. This forum is where Marketing and Customer Service meet. This forum is another part of your public face to the world and another primary input for Customer Service. When done right, Customer Service can give useful information to Engineering not only about problems but customer desires. Marketing, you can use these forums to measure and improve the feelings of your customers, both current and future. I know that some people believe that company forums are nothing but a house of complaints where customers want to fight, yell, and scream for things they don't deserve, then fight, yell, and scream at each other for whatever reason, be it entertainment or insanity. But, anyone trained in Marketing knows that most data you get back is noise. You're looking for the needle in the haystack. You're looking for those insights that you can throw to Engineering so they can create something new, or at least catch up with the pack, if not surpassing them. I believe that's what you did with the Triton -> Triton 2 tank change. The complaints not only changed from noise to data, useful information went to engineering and design. I have the Triton 2 tank, and I'm very pleased with it. I think I wouldn't have had a good experience with the original Triton just due to what I've read in many different places.

    I'll try to end off here. Aspire, you have a Design department to create the look and feel of the equipment, an Engineering department to create the equipment, a Customer Service department to handle issues from End Users and Shop Vendors. You have a Marketing department that does everything it can to not only show the products in the best possible way, but also to improve the brand recognition and public reaction to the company and the products. Please use this forum to connect Marketing and Customer Service, just as a start. Use the information to show how the marketing is working, where the problems are coming from, and what people are thinking about wanting in the future. This information is deeply useful to Marketing, and they can push this info to Design and Engineering to not only keep up with the crowd, but to pass them by with even more amazing, useful, or just NEW and INTERESTING products and services.

    But, that's my perspective.
  • Then again I think what you are speaking about is the "Ramp Up" time of the coil itself in the TC mode. That first puff will take longer than the second as with the second puff the coil is already hot to a point. This again may have to do more with battery power than anything else. Before I get ahead of myself maybe someone with more TC Experience can weigh in here as I don't use the TC function for that very reason. In the future I believe that Aspire is planning a dual battery mod that could help in this respect.
  • Uhhhh....what? No, really what I have found to be true is the same thing you experienced (first puff weak, second one better) when I am using a battery in my mod that can't handle the wattage as well. I am using the .5 ohm coils in wattage mode so YMMV. The best course of action would be to try a more powerful battery first before going to another mod that might not do the trick with a substandard battery. The Pegasus model mods have a throttling circuit built in so that if the battery can't handle what you are asking of it, it throttles down to a lower power that it can handle. I suggest trying the Aspire 20-40A Super High Discharge battery or another like it before investing in another mod.

    Now that is useful information. The battery I bought when I got the Odyssey kit is a blank, green battery with a sticker that says "18650 2500mAh 3.7V" with a tiny CE in the lower right corner of the silver sticker. I can't tell who made the battery or anything else about it.

    So, if I'm shopping for batteries (which I will be on Monday), exactly what should I be looking for? Remember, I'm a temp control fiend, using NI200 coils bought from an Aspire dealer and verified with the scratch off number as original, so I won't be going to wattage mode. I see above that you suggest the Aspire 20-40A Super High Discharge battery, but what will it say on it? What will the mAh be? I can see in the Pegasus and Pegasus mini instructions that they're putting a 2500mAh in both mods. Does that mean I should only accept an Aspire brand 2500mAh 20-40A battery, or are there other manufacturers batteries that are equivalent?
  • I've been doing a little bit of experimentation this afternoon. I removed the temp control big Triton 2 coil that read 0.15 ohms and replaced it with the orange O-ring 0.5 ohm Clapton coil. The instructions that came with the tank for that coil said to run it at 40-45 watts. I changed the Mini Pegasus to Ka, then adjusted the wattage to 40 watts. When I pressed the fire button, the ohms for the coil read at 0.48 which is close enough to 0.5, the Voltage read 4.83V. I took a draw off it, and the vapor was thick and very warm. I dropped the wattage down to 28.6W so the voltage read exactly 3.70V. I took another few draws, and the vapor was thick and somewhat warm. I let the vape sit for a while to let everything cool off, then drew on it again. The vapor was thick and warm, but comfortable, and that was the first draw, not the second in a short timeframe.

    I believe that @charlzrocks was exactly right when he referred to the throttling circuit of the Pegasus models. With a Triton 2 .5 (reading 0.48) ohm coil on the Mini, and turning it up all the way to 50W, the voltage of 4.89V was shown on the display. Calculating that out, that's 49.8 Watts and 10 Amps.

    With all this said and done, I think the Pegasus Mini and the temp control coils in a Triton 2 clearomizer just push the mod past its limits and the throttling circuits come into play to protect the mod. Heck, even using a .5 ohm coil at 40 Watts pushes things pretty hard on the Pegasus mini. If I set the watts back to 28.6 with the big half ohm coil in the Triton 2, I get good clouds, great taste, and the system only has to generate 7.7 Amps. I'm going to have to wait until I get a Pegasus or a higher wattage TC mod before I can go back to the NI200 temperature control coils in this Triton 2 tank, or go back to the Mini Triton clearomizer to use with this Pegasus mini.

    I'm probably going to be getting a new mod on Monday, depending on what my favorite shop has available, but I'll definitely have to move to a higher wattage mod to do temp control coils. Until then, I'll just use the .5 and under-watt the settings on the Mini Pegasus to keep from breaking the mod or having a bad temp control experience.

    Thanks for the replies, attention, and assistance.
  • @GPF
    Glad to be of assistance. And thanks to @Old_Salt for his expertise as well!
    The Aspire battery information is located here: https://www.aspirecig.com/products/MOD/mod222.html and here: https://www.aspirecig.com/products/MOD/mod206.html
    I hope this helps, let us know what Mod/battery combination you end up with!
  • @charlzrocks @GPF howcome every time I change my tank on my Pegasus battery never says new atomizer question? And it doesn't give me the choice to choose KA or TI? When I put the temperature control coil that came with the Odyssey kit and it does change the temperature mode but still doesn't give me the choice for KI or TI?
  • @mike2for1
    I found that when I change to a different tank on my Pegasus it's best to take the tank off and then press the fire button so that it says "Check Atomizer". Then when I put the new tank on it will ask which coil type. I am assuming that you have the Pegasus V2.....
  • @charlzrocks how do I tell if it's the Pegasus V2 version?
  • @mike2for1
    The Pegasus version 2 is not an automatic coil detection mod like the first version where you hold the fire button and the mod determines the type of coil in the tanked that you have on it. On the version 2 you use the rotating wheel and fire button to determine the coil type and the regulated/unregulated mode.
  • @charlzrocks I don't know how to tell if it's version 1 or 2?? It does switch when I put the red coil in, but it's never asked me about the KA or TI?? Or never asks me NEW ATOMIZER??
  • @charlzrocks I think I do? I got the ODESSEY kit with the Teton 2 tank in black and the PEGASUS in slate?? I used the code in the back and it checked out ok. He said it was new and that's why it's not on there site.. when I put the TC coil in, it changes to temp. Mode but hasn't asked if its KA or TI ??? Or never asked NEW ATOMIZER???
  • @mike2for1
    Before you put a new atomizer tank on the Pegasus, press the fire button when there isn't a tank on it so it says "check atomizer" then screw the new tank on and if it's a Pegasus V1 it will test fire to determine the coil in use.
  • @charlzrocks it's only supposed to ask all of those things when u have a TC coil in it??? How come it doesn't ask, NEW ATOMIZER?
  • The Pegasus V1 Will not ask for a new atomizer, it is automatic and will auto fire when the tank is put on and determine the type of coil by itself. The V2 will ask for the type of coil, it's not automatic like the V1. If you put a KA coil on the Pegasus V1 it will automaticly switch to wattage control. sorry if I wasn't clear on that, I was at work and kept getting interrupted while I was trying to answer your posts.
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